Kenneth Madden

Conscious TV interview.

I just wanted to write a few lines about the interview I did on ConsciousTV. A lot of people have contacted me through this site regarding the message that is being communicated there, often referred to as Non Duality, or a Non Duality message. I forget then that the majority have never heard of Non Duality and many people have said that they watched (some of) of interview and didn’t have a clue what I was on about! What I am talking about cannot be spoken, so I’m not too worried about whether or not I could communicate it well. I would however like to make it clear now, that what was being suggested was that we are all as individuals searching for something in one way or another and that what we search for is simply life itself, not what’s happening in it. We search as we feel separate to life, we feel we are negotiating our lives through life. What is being suggested is that that viewpoint only appears to be real. There is in fact nobody that is separate to life, there is only one ‘Life’ one energy, Oneness. So all that we take to be absolutely real; time, distance, choice, consequence, cause and effect etc are only apparently real, they appear in the dream of being a separate self, they do not exist only from this false center. This all sounds interesting, maybe lovely or perhaps frightening but the significance of this suggestion is totally beyond the minds ability of comprehension. It is what comprehension arises in. It is the seeing that this is infinity, this is eternity and THIS (what’s happening right now) my friend is fucking miraculous, unconditional love. Now that’s something (and nothing).

So, yes it can’t be spoken but life loves to speak. Thanks for the e-mails, I really enjoy hearing people’s perspectives. The plan is to communicate an uncompromising message on a site called www.Lifeinfreefall.com that will soon be under construction by my brilliant web designer. This site will get an overhaul and be solely for photography. Some people have asked about meetings, I have no idea if they’ll happen or not, but I had no idea I’d end up on Conscious TV talking about this (and by this I mean literally this now, what appears to be happening). I do think that the sharing of this message at meetings is much much more powerful then any other means of communicating it as there is an energetic resonance in and around what is being suggested that is can be very liberating, a clear invitation to see that what you have always sought has never ever left you.
So we’ll see what apparently happens!

21 Comments

Liesel said:

Hi Kenneth,

I saw your interview on Conscious TV and found it really strange. You seem to think that liberation has occurred yet you sound like a poor copy of Tony Parsons. It’s like you swallowed a bunch of his sound bites and just regurgitated them at Ian, even down to describing liberation as ‘Juicy’ – that’s such a Tony thing to say – and that this is ‘life in free fall’ etc. etc.

I would have thought that after liberation, each ‘character’ would have a unique way of expressing this message, yet not one thing that came out of your mouth was remotely fresh or new. Are you sure you’re not in the throes of a big ‘awakening’ and that there’s still a little bit of you lurking somewhere – because something seems very off.

If you really don’t think you have an agenda and knowing Tony as well as you do, I sense that would be your response here, why are you subtly pushing to give meetings on your blog? By saying that you ‘don’t know’ if you’re going to give meetings and in the same breath adding that they ‘can be very liberating’ is waving a huge cosmic carrot in front of poor, desperate seekers and if you can’t see that you’re in total denial.

The mere fact that you’ve been putting it about on Urban Guru Cafe and Conscious TV suggests that liberation has not happened, most of the non duality heads on the internet are just awakened… do you really want to join that gang?

I look forward to hearing your response,

Best Wishes,

Liesel

9:56 pm July 12, 2010 | Link
Kenneth said:

Hello Liesel,
I don’t think it has occured as it’s not a happening and there is no liberation. Also everything is fresh and new.
Thanks
Kenneth

10:42 pm July 12, 2010 | Link
Kenneth said:

and also- there is no Tony Parsons! ha ha. An uncompromising message is no ones message.
Best
kenneth

11:10 pm July 12, 2010 | Link
Liesel said:

Thanks so much for responding, Kenneth,

And yes… there is no Tony Parsons, no Kenneth, no Liesel.

But then, hang on, with regards to this ‘uncompromising message’ here, how could there ever be a compromising message- if there is no one to compromise and no one to be compromised, surely then, all messages are uncompromising? Are they?

Best Wishes,

Liesel

9:39 am July 13, 2010 | Link
Kenneth said:

From this perspective there is an apparent dilemma that comes from feeling like an individual. This is an apparent dilemma as the individual is only apparent. There is a story that comes from this sense of being an individual, the story of me and the world I relate to. The majority of messages under what is termed ‘Non Duality” speak directly to the individual and offer them something, there is some sort of agenda, they offer perhaps a method, or hope or stress understanding etc for an separate self to realize or see that there is no separate self. These messages come from the agenda of an apparent Teacher (although they may say they aren’t one) and meet the agenda of the apparent seeker. They are a feedback system. There is nothing wrong with this of course.

An uncompromising message then, offers nothing whatsoever to the individual as it does not recognize an individual, it see’s being or unconditional love pretending to be an individual or individualizing. This type of message is much rarer but seems to be cropping up more.

As there is only unconditional love, Being, Liberation or whatever you want to call it, there is only that appearing as both types of messages, it’s just that the function of one is to keep the individual locked into the story and the other can reveal that there is no story. It is impossible for an uncompromising message to not be seen as a carrot of some sort. It is communicated in the knowing that it cannot be communicated without being seen as a carrot to the individual but there is no movement to not disappoint them or to offer them something as of course what is being communicated is the death of the apparent individual. Life is not seen as it really is until there is no ‘me’ looking out at it.
Best
Kenneth

7:44 pm July 13, 2010 | Link
Liesel said:

Kenneth, I really appreciate you getting back to me, thank you x

Within the context of this story, can you see where the apparent ‘I’ is coming from? The apparent ‘Kenneth’ gave an apparent interview where he talked about his apparent childhood etc and an apparent awakening he had while doing a course in meditation, followed by a return of the apparent ‘I’ and then a falling away of the apparent ‘I’.

And the apparent ‘Liesel’ was really struck by the fact that everything he said, sounded like a carbon copy of the apparent ‘Tony Parsons’.

Every apparent snowflake is unique ergo isn’t every apparent individual? Why is there no sense of that from your message?

Can you at least entertain the fact that there may be a little bit of the apparent kenneth still there, that hesitates, because I have heard the apparent you at Tony’s gatherings and I have noticed that hesitation, that subtle backtracking to fall in line with what the apparent ‘Tony’ says. And I think that subtle hesitation is there because although it is seen from your perspective that all there is is this and it is stunning, there is also still a teensy bit of apparent confusion.

I don’t men to sound judgemental or antagonistic. For the record, I’d take an awakening any day of the week…

Maybe I’m emailing you because the apparent ‘I’ did psychology and finds this whole thing fascinating. And I hear stories of many apparent people who think liberation has happened (and you know what I mean when I say that) but after a while it’s realised that there’s still a bit of an apparent ‘I’ remaining and it’s almost like they can’t admit it to anyone because too may people think liberation has happened and they can’t backtrack because they’d feel like a tit.

And if your non duality career takes off and that happens to you, it’d be really crappy for you.

But hey, there’s always the possibility that you could end up on an island in fiji with a bunch of sex slave play boy bunny types like Adi Da did and have a great old time… so this story could have a happy ending yet…

What do you think?

Liesel

8:56 pm July 13, 2010 | Link
Kenneth said:

Honestly Liesel, I couldn’t give a fuck.

Everything you’ve said is simply your interpretation and perspective. I don’t see separate selves at a Tony Parsons meeting or anywhere else so there is no one here monitoring people’s comments to see if they are confused or if they think themselves to be there. It is only from the perspective of a separate self that it is evaluated and weighed up whether or not there is an apparent ‘other’ separate self. If there is no separate self then there is no apparent other separate self.

There is no ‘Other’ so there is no one who is liberated as opposed to someone beside them who is not liberated. It is from one contracted sense of self that there can be any degree of other contracted sense of self in another.

The whole Liberation, Non-Duality debate is of no relevance as there is no Liberation, no Non -Duality only in the story of an apparent self.

All I can say to you is that if you think this message is a confused one, or that I am a ‘poor copy of Tony Parons’ as you put it- then why even bother contacting me in the first place to leave long comments peppered with personal information such as you having done psychology(!) and judgmental remarks about the interviews??

It’s really amusing to me that you assign me states of mind from comments made at meetings, that you talk about my Non Duality Career! (haha that’s a cracker) and that you would like me to admit that there’s something left of me so I can have a happy ending! Brilliant, really lovely. I have found the whole thing very amusing so thanks once again.
Best
Kenneth

9:58 pm July 13, 2010 | Link
Liesel said:

You’re very welcome, Kenneth! Glad you find the whole thing so amusing, brilliant and lovely.

You asked why I would bother contacting someone I find confusing and a poor copy of TP, so I’m gonna ask you the same question, why bother with the blog and new website? If there’s no apparent self there, and you can’t see any other apparent selves, who the hell are you gonna be communicating to?

If all is liberation and the non duality debate is of no relevance – why not just leave it be and enjoy life.

Or is there a special buzz to be had from all those eager, (preferably!) female eyes looking at you with joy and adoration… because you have that uncompromising message (who told them you had it, hmm?!!)

Not bad for a boy from Galway.

Respect!!!

10:43 pm July 13, 2010 | Link
Kenneth said:

who’s going to leave it be and enjoy life?
This easily slips into a word game, I’ve been as clear as I can and this is becoming a bit farcical to be honest, you’re now making out that I’m looking for attention from women! ha ha, Wonderful.
Take care and thanks
Kenneth

11:15 pm July 13, 2010 | Link
frank said:

Kenneth whats this about an Island in Fiji… I can’t believe you didn’t tell me about this….Seriously I will be the cook on the Island..or even the kitchen help…I cook a mean vegetarian dish (my secret ingredient is meat :-) )

Liesel suggest you go to Urban Guru cafe, there everyone loves to fight and be ‘right’ all the time. It can be so satisfying to be right.

Nisargadatta used to scream at people when they would ask him questions that were an attempt to try and catch him out..saying “You don’t even know who you are and yet you ask me this. Who are you?”…suggesting that people invest energy in picking holes in the whole world and yet are never curious about that which is doing the hole picking. Though you never get that feeling of being ‘right’ that way,so what would be the point I suppose. Jeebus talked about taking the plank out of your own eye as a suggestion to focus your energy within, not as a practise, not as a practise, not as a practise but just something he said. I bet he heard that from Nisaraggatta..blooy copy cat.

I am excited about your meetings Kenneth if they ever happen.. You’re getting abuse and you’ve hardly opened your mouth :-)

I better get an invite.. I pay top dollar for enlightenment.

2:34 pm July 14, 2010 | Link
Liesel said:

Frank, you’re killing me… I think I’d have to do a few more rounds with Kenneth before I sound as demented as Gilbert et al in the Urban Guru Cafe.

Kenneth, Mea Culpa.

Maybe I’ve been burnt in the past by non-duality charlatans and maybe I saw a non-duality Irish guy and because I’m Irish, I simultaneously saw red and went in for the attack.

Maybe I was overly antagonistic, judgemental and downright bold in an attempt to get a rise out of you.

But no rise happened.

You responded with good grace, good will and good humour. And I can only conclude that you are one of the good guys.

Let’s end this on a happy note. I truly wish you well in however life unfolds for you.

Best Wishes,

Liesel

8:15 pm July 14, 2010 | Link
maria said:

Hi Kenneth,

I enjoyed the interview a lot. I just came across conscious tv a few days ago. It was nice to hear an Irish person speaking about non-duality. You have some lovely photographs too.

Best wishes,
Maria

6:33 pm July 15, 2010 | Link
Kenneth said:

Frank, I had no intention of telling you about the island- there’s only room for one rooster in that hen house! If you’re very good to me I may consider taking you along though, so there’s some hope to keep you going.

I am thinking of doing a kind of Tesco’s two for one special when the meetings start, that is awakening and liberation for the price of liberation. The only thing is everything is costly.

Liesel, what I’m saying now is not a play of words and I know that you are familiar with all the Non-Dual word games that go on, I am aware that you know there is no you, that you know that there is no Liesel. This has absolutely nothing to do with knowing.

It’s not Mea Culpa, there is no ‘Mea’ so there is no Culpa, there is no end and no beginning to what appears as this exchange of comments. I am not one of the good guys, I am not one of the bad guys, I am one (and you could remove the I to get closer, then the am, then the one).

There is no-one. There is no Gilbert and no awakened non-duality heads in a gang, no Urban Guru Cafe people.
There are no separate people at Tony Parsons meetings making comments, none that are clear and none that are confused (only confusion and clarity arising). The only separation is the apparent one in the apparent individual and only from that one apparent separation are there apparent ‘others’ who are not awakened, awakened, between awakening and liberation, liberated etc. There is no one who is liberated as liberation is the seeing that there is no one.

Liesel has only being apparently burned by apparent Non Dual Charlatans as all of that is in the story of a separate self called Liesel.

I know that this Non Duality stuff is a total head fuck and as I have often said it is mostly bullshit as it speaks to separate individual with choice and volition. There is no one who can choose to get into it or get out of it, it’s whats happening. These words to you Liesel are true compassion, unconditional love is the seeing that there is no Liesel, the seeing that the comments made are not good or bad and have no significance whatsoever, they are only Being playing the game of hide and seek.

As regards your earlier comments about my comments at meetings- Of course confusion arose at Tony Parsons meetings and there may have been, like you observed, some kind of effort to keep in line with what was being said. There was some residue of me left, something of me left and simultaneously a seeing that this was absolutely what was being sought and that there was no me at all. I definitely noticed that there seemed to be some kind of wish for it to be seen that what was being spoken about was seen here. And then it was seen that that was also it. Liberation wasn’t something that I can say happened a year ago or six months ago or 6 days ago or six hours ago because it is the end of something that never was and is not a happening or an experience, is not located in time and space. It’s kind of like saying when did I realize that this is eternity? well I didn’t realize is this morning because it was the seeing that there is no this morning.

I think what I enjoyed most about this (apparent) exchange was the point that there is only apparently a separate person over there, when there is apparently a separate person that see’s them as separate. In actuality there is nobody and nothing that is separate.


When one’s in chains then there ain’t none of us free

Martha Scanlan, Isabella

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXAjNxYY7AM

Hug
Kenneth

12:29 am July 16, 2010 | Link
Kenneth said:

Thanks a lot Maria, Best wishes to you.
Kenneth

10:47 pm July 18, 2010 | Link
Gloria said:

Hi Kenneth, I have just watched the Conscious TV interview and thought it was truly wonderful. Left a comment under pseudonym ‘maechee.’ One of the things I really liked about what you said is that there is no teacher and no student and how ‘teachers’ who play that game are just playing with the ‘students’ and creating a continuous feedback loop (my interpretation of what you said).

I have felt this intuitively for a long time and even though I have played the game (to fill a perceived need) I have never felt at home with it. I was going to an ‘enlightened’ zen teacher and although I had no doubt of her integrity I felt very ill at ease with the business operation and the whole teacher-student set up. I got to the stage where I just couldn’t do it anymore.

My rationale was that if I was going to ‘get’ enlightenment from a transmission, I would get it from the cat who doesn’t miss an opportunity to grace my lap with her presence and has no respect for the fact that I am meditating.

You are a breath of fresh air and I just don’t get the Tony Parsons bitching.

The best of Irish blessings to you from one who inhabits the land of the Urban Guru Cafe.

8:00 am September 10, 2010 | Link
Kenneth said:

H Gloria
Thanks for your comment. I wouldn’t say that the teachers are playing with the students in that they are simply in the role of teacher, do you know what I mean? In other words most of them aren’t really trying to fool a student or anything, they sincerly believe they are enlightened and wish to show others the way. Their agenda is then complemented or met by the agenda of the student and a feedback loop is made. It is of course only apparent anyway, only happening in the story of a separate self.
I like what you say about intuitively feeling that your Teacher- student relationship was somehow false. You are right, the notion that one person can have a transmition to another is absolute nonsense as is the notion that someone can be enlightened as the word really means the seeing that there is no one, therefor there is no one to be enlightened.
I wouldn’t have any problem with a living being made financially out of a message, that is no indication to me of wheather or not it is an uncompromising message or not. There seems to be some sort of perception that a genuine message should not involve any financial gain as if the person giving it should live in poverty. That is clearly nonsense as far as I’m concerned. There shouldn’t be however, any kind of direction to come to meetings or a certain number of meetings or whatever, as who would they be telling to come or not come?

The last thing is that YOU won’t get enlightened from the teacher, the cat or anything else of course- you’re not there to begin with. Hense the paradox, liberation or whatever you want to call it is the end of something that never was.
Really great to hear from you Gloria, thanks again.
Best
Kenneth

1:34 pm September 11, 2010 | Link
Gloria said:

Hi Kenneth, I hear what you say and thanks for the feedback.

I didn’t mean to imply that I think it is wrong to benefit financially from teaching, I am not in that camp, but I saw and experienced some subtle exploitation (or perhaps emotional manipulation is a better term) by the ‘non-enlightened’ one, of the devotion of students. No harm done, it seems to be part and parcel of any kind of organisation around a central figure, human beings being what we are.

Even as I write these words, I can’t quite believe them like I used to but I guess I’m still somewhat attached to my theories and opinions!

4:33 am September 18, 2010 | Link
Kenneth said:

oh ya there is all sorts of exploitation and game playing when there is an agenda and a set up whereby someone proclaims themselves as teacher who can show a student the way to liberation or enlightenment or whatever. It is very obvious when you see it. More then anything it keeps people in an apparent prison of individuality. It’s total nonsense. It is also in the story of a separate self though, so really there is no one being exploited or mislead, only apparently. For instance if someone were to say that such and such a teacher exploited me or mislead me is really only serving to reinforce a story of victimhood. Everything that apparently happens is absolutely appropriate.
Whats sought is simply Being- without the addition of “Me”, so what is sought by the individual is their own absence. There is only that, there is only this (This and that being the same), there is only life, Being: breathing, sitting, typing, thinking, walking, talking- and nobody doing it. It is a total arrogance and ignorance to believe that I can teach someone to do all of the above, teach someone to Be Being. Nonsense.
Thanks again Gloria.
KK

12:56 pm September 18, 2010 | Link
Gloria said:

“It is also in the story of a separate self though, so really there is no one being exploited or mislead, only apparently. For instance if someone were to say that such and such a teacher exploited me or mislead me is really only serving to reinforce a story of victimhood. Everything that apparently happens is absolutely appropriate.”

I get what you are saying and appreciate the way in which you express it. I have for pretty much all of my 60 years of life identified with the victim position and alternately played the role of rescuer. It is all showing up in sharp relief and I am feeling much confusion in the letting go of identification.

There is resistance to seeing that I am also the exploiter – that none of these roles can exist in isolation. Confusion, and also a kind of comfort that I am no longer in complete denial.

5:03 am September 25, 2010 | Link
Deirdre Breen said:

Hi Kenneth,
I watched your interview on conscious tv and I really liked what you had to say. I am a little astounded at some of the comments, but I will say no more on that subject.

Deirdre

7:21 pm June 23, 2012 | Link
Kenneth said:

Hi Deirdre, I’m glad you enjoyed it, maybe ‘enjoyed’ isn’t the right word- struck a cord maybe, resonated with you.
Oh ya , by the way, say whatever comes to mind, there is no right or wrong and you’re not saying anything anyway. (you are being done. )
ha, amazing.
best
K

10:58 pm June 23, 2012 | Link

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